Silverado or Tundra

[Central Bassman]

I have looked at a Tundra and they are for sure going to be me next truck. I went to Rochester Toyota to look at one. They seem to have the best customer services at a car dealer that i have ever seen.

[Scott K]

I see none of you are very old, either that or you have real bad memories! Lets look back at the vehicles of the 1960-1980! If you got 100,000 miles on it, you probably put a new engine and tranny in it! The things smoked like mad, burnt oil, sucked gas, and were carberated and you had to change plugs and points every 10k! How many of you want to go out and start and warm up your carb vehicles on a -30 day? The vehicles are built way better today then they were 20 years ago! Sure a few more things go wrong with todays cars, but there are a few more options to go wrong then there was then! If you want a truck that doesnt have any problems, buy one with manual windows, manual locks, no radio, 2 wheel drive, manual tranny.

Sure they charge top dollar and they shouldnt break down, but in comparison to past vehicles, today people put 100k in a year and complain that they had to bring it in for service!

[Jeremy airjer W]

If you want a truck that doesnt have any problems, buy one with manual windows, manual locks, no radio, 2 wheel drive, manual tranny.

You just described my Tacoma! Except it was 4WD (manual linkage) and it did have an aftermarket radio. My Tundra is the first automatic I have owned since high school. I did have to get power windows because I wanted the rear power sliding window and the 4 door was not built with a manual. Otherwise it would be manual everything with a stick! Don't get me started on ABS!!!

[CJH]

The quality is much better than they used to be on all of them, with alot more things to go wrong as mentioned.

To be quite honest, I think its a horse a piece. They are both good trucks. The Tundra has some cool features, is all new and has a the Toyota reputation for quality and service (despite the issues mentioned above). The Chevy is rock solid with two good V8's (5.3 and 6.0), a proven track record, good mileage, and the 100k powertrain warranty.

Based on my personal experience, I believe service is more directly related to the individual dealership and the people who run it.

I personally like the styling of the Chevy better, but that's completely subjective. Find the one that's the best fit and price for you.

[hamrej23]

If you read the fine print on that Dodge warranty you will see it is a joke.

Oh yeah, what points are that? Can you tell me?

Just curious...

[Valv]

I think CJH has the right reply, there's no need to start debates on which brand is better or not since it's just subjective and will make this thread endless (thanks a lot Iffwalleyest !!)

Nowadays all trucks have many good reputation and few bad ones, it's just a matter of of personal coice and also don't forget financial incentives, a low % financing or good warranty is hard to beat.

[Shack]

Quote:

If you read the fine print on that Dodge warranty you will see it is a joke.

All fine print of a manufactures warranty might seem light a joke , thank the lawyers for this.

Actually I would hold Dodge’s warranty up as one of the best and one of the easiest manufacturers the get warranty items authorized. Most times the decision is at the dealer lever.

I will give it to Dodge, about 5-6 years ago, they pulled all the stops out to gain customer loyalty back they lost in the mid to late nineties with some of the pooch minivans, mid sized and compact car they had.

Now, Ford on the other hand, has gone the opposite. They used to be the best in warranty authorization’s and less hassle with pushing things threw. They also used to have the best after warranty adjustment (A.W.A.) programs out their. Now, that is a thing of the past.

As far a customer loyalty, you can not beet Honda and Toyota. They have some of the strongest customer loyalty in the market place today. The big “3” can no longer come close and have spent millions over the last 10 years to figure out why?? It pretty much came down to how the new car delivery went and the first 12,000 miles of service and how the service department approached the customer.

[iffwalleyes]

I know it is a horse a piece but I have my decision narrowed down to these two. Not sure when I am going to jump and get one it might not be until next year. Lmitout I don't think that I will be doing a diesel again it is fun to have a diesel but just really not necessary for me to have one. Mileage for me has never been much better than I used to get with my old 5.3 gaser and it doesn't look like diesel will ever come back to reality. That new 1/2 ton diesel would have to get well into the 20's for me to consider it.

[LMITOUT]

Yeah I hear ya on the price of fuel. It used to be cheaper than unleaded and with the better mileage to boot it was great. I would think that 1/2 ton w/diesel should get some very good mpg's.

[Valv]

The really HUGE problem with new diesel trucks is emission control, they "rob" 2mpg to 4 mpg or more in average. All i the name of pollution control.

Unfortunately US automaker haven't figure d it out how to balance it yet. I wish they study, or better copy the European to get results.

[LMITOUT]

That stuff can pretty easily be circumvented if need be.

[hamrej23]

Yeah VAlv-- new federal emissions made the diesels move to the bigger displacements example- dodge 5.9 to 6.7

[Shack]

Example: Ford, 7.3L to a 6.0L and then up to a 6.4 .

[jltimm]

I hope your not trying to figure out ford's thinkings? It seems like they are going backwards to me? Here I always thought that this increase in engine size was for the HP and torque wars of the big three?

[Valv]

The only thing they care is emissions, That's why they have burners on the exhaust, special programs to idle higher when idle, etc, etc. Results, a 5.9l Dodge used to do 19mpg, now it does 12mpg. Have you seen the videos about Ford flam throwers ? Well it was scary but Dodge had them too. A new "genius" idea to reduce emissions, burn the exhaust gasses, but the European using urea injection have better emission and keep power and mileage, check the new Mercedes TD.

The only one that right now it's getting away from 2010 regs it's Chevy. Look at the new Duramax, the exhaust tip is vented. When the truck is running exhaust draws air from behind the tip and adds it to the gasses. EPA reader detects more O2 and consequently truck passes emission tests cheating. It's working now for few more months, but soon GM has to catch up, the motor won't meet 2010 regs., the other 2 do already.

Ok, stop my rant now... :grin

[LMITOUT]

I've noticed the new Fords have the goofy tailpipe as well, so either they're "getting away with it" too, or it's legit like the Duramax tailpipe configuration. Maybe on the Ford's it's intended to enhance the cooking experience?

The new smaller Duramax is supposedly equipped with that urea concept also.

[Valv]

Ford and Dodge are 2010 compliant, GM is not.

Ford will not have a motor next year, Navistar will not produce any anymore, there was talk of Volvo (since they own it) or it's own Ford motor (good luck there).

[LMITOUT]

I did some digging around and see they are going to add the urea treatment to the Duramax for 2010 to make it compliant. It doesn't have anything to do with the tailpipe though, and as mentioned, the Ford has a vented pipe too.

Who would have thought that the exhaust system on a truck would be almost as complicated as a 6-speed automatic transmission. All this does is trickle down to the consumer and increases the upfront costs as well as any repair costs in the future. It seems as though they are penalizing those who choose to purchase vehicles which are essentially cleaner and get better mileage than their gas powered counterparts. I bought my truck in 2006 because I knew it was going to be one of the last "good ones" and hope to hold onto it for quite a while.

[DinkADunk]

Valv, the funny exhaust on the LMM Duramax is to cool the exhaust gas temperatures before they leave the truck. When an LMM goes into regen the EGT after the DPF reaches 1100F or so and needs to be cooled off prior to leaving the vehical. The exhaust tail piece is designed (venturi effect) to suck in a bunch of outside air in order to cool off the exhaust. It's not a trick to fool emissions tests.

[fishinJohn]

So when will the Tundra be out with a diesel? I recall a four cylinder toyota diesel my boss drove 300k mi+ back when I worked on a fruit/veggie farm. What's wrong with ABS?