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goldenwalleye

Tribal Member Bag Limits

42 posts in this topic

One more reason we need to let our government know that something needs to be done.

I'm not sure how many people actually know what the Tribal Members Bag limits are, but I just verified through the DNR and it is upsetting.

They are allow to keep a bag limit (walleye) of 10 fish daily. No restrictions on size, and no possession limit.

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I know what the limit is, and it's more in Wisconsin. You can cry like big babies to your politicians all you want, the situation is not going to change. Learn to live with it. It can only get worse, thats what happened in wisconsin. A handful were trying to assert there rights. And the state said "no". the lawsuits followed and now the natives have the rights in three states to fish and hunt off reservation.

What probably will happen if the tribes get mad, they will file another lawsuit to regain the rights of the 1854 treaty area, that covers the area all the way to canada. This will cost taxpayers millions again. The same tribes signed this treaty with the same agreement hunting and fishing off reservation. Right now only 1 or 2 tribes take advantage of it under and agreement the the state and the 1854 Authority.

Be lucky there is a limit of ten, the limit the Great Lakes Indian Fish and Wildlife Commission could change the limit to 100.

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What!! Shut up so the tribes don't get mad. Are you kidding me!!!!!!

I need a minute to think about this one.

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Ok I have calmed down.

There are lakes in Wisconsin that are down to a limit of two walleye's (in the slot) because they have to adjust to the the tribes allotments. And these are GOOD walleye lakes, not no name lakes. If you want to not believe this is coming here you are kidding yourself.

One thing I notice is the people who post with these thoughs never reveal there location. Why is that?

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What I do not understand is how many people are so willing to say "thats just the way it is" Do you realizes that you are in a country were you do not have to except something you believe is wrong? That you can actually do something about it! Take 5 min. and e-mail your rep's, discuss this with people you know care but do not understand the problems. All the little things DO make a difference. The worst thing you can do is accept something you believe is wrong because you do not want to make the small effort to express what you believe in.

PLEASE Everyone, if you have and opinion express it! Make a differance!

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Quote:
PLEASE Everyone, if you have and opinion express it! Make a differance!

Here I go grin:

Quote:
Take 5 min. and e-mail your rep's, discuss this with people you know care but do not understand the problems.

First off, do not even waste your time e-mailing you “state rep”, this will do almost no good. Again folks, THIS IS A FEDERAL ISSUE, NOT A STATE ISSUE.

You guys can do what you want, but the Markster is right on! Straight and narrow.

I have said it before and I will say it again, if the one and a million chance this was brought up for review on a Federal level, us MN anglers better be ready for failure. Short and sweet, the President of the United States has the final say in things, but most likely the Supreme Court would end up with this (in vary hypothetical point of view) and you better bet your bottom dollar the Supreme Court has a sympathetic ear to MN anglers over the natives and the Treaty. I bet they wont. The tribes have the power, will go for more and I will bet they will win.

Instead of e-mailing your Senator and such, e-mail or call the best law office in this state and ask them what it will cost and the chances of a win for the MN angler. If they would even take a case like this on, I would hate to even know what the retainer amount would be crazy. That would be the best start IMO.

Vent and fester about this all you want, I feel that is as far as it will go.

Things are good on Mille Lacs and thanks to channel 9 calling it the “Dead Sea”, the anglers are going to stay away. I for see some great fishing in the future this season.

Page back in this forum to last fall and see some of the walleyes caught by F.M.’ers. Last fall was hot for the smart anglers that found them.

Do what you want, but I will not waste any of my spare fishing time for this cause.

Go up, learn the Pond, have fun and fish. You will learn how to get fish and have fun doing it. Life is to short to fight a fight you are not going to win. Go up, support the local economy and use the fine resorts F.M. has above. You will catch fish smile !

A big Good luck smile!

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Whenver I read something like this, its reminds me of the Declaration of Independence. Below is the introduction and preamble:

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

......Your President, U.S. Congress and Senate is there to serve you, not cater to the special interests and make reparations for perceived past sins. If you don't like whats happening on Lake Mille Lacs, you need to take action and vote in those that will change things.

People don't talk like this anymore because we have to be politically correct nowadays, which makes no sense to me. Not to turn this into a political debate, but people need to take some personal responsibility for this. We elect the lawmakers that allow this stuff to continue. If we had lost the Revolutionary War, the people that wrote the Declaration would have been executed for treason. Thank god we didn't because this is the greatest nation on earth, but we choose to live in a Democracy and we elect the politicians that allow this to continue and appoint the judges that uphold these rulings......if you don't like it, do something about....If there are enough of us, we can make a change. If not, we have to live with it.....end of story.....

Just my 2 cents....I don't agree with it but there isn't much I can do about it, except vote.....

Again, please don't start a political debate here on me. As sports-people (trying to be politically correct) we have to stick together and have our voice heard....

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After the Red Lake Nation desimated the walleye in upper and lower red lakes that make up the largest single inland water way in the state, we the State of Minnesota restock the lake with 41 MILLION fry, WHY? They have proven themselves to be poor stewards of their own resource!

And is it not the State of Minnesota that manages and stocks ML?

Is it not the State of MN that maintains the accesses on ML?

Is it not the State that maintains HWY 169 through the Res so all the gamblers can squander their money? (their right to do so)

Who created the Musky fishing on ML?

who created the Smallie fishing on ML?

The people of MN have a vested interest in the resource because it is so tied to the economy, and does not the state wish to see a return on our investments?

Does the ML band pay property taxes to the State?

Does the ML band pay income taxes that reinvest in the resource?

And finally when will the courts get over the guilt complex that lends it's hand to this sort of ruling. and when will the people of MN get over the same psuedo guilt so that all the tribes can truely be allowed to stand on their own instead of the current addiction to our hard earned tax dollars.

Just curious.

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As sports-people (trying to be politically correct) we have to stick together and have our voice heard....

Except that we don't all agree, so there's really no "sticking together" on the issue.

Federal treaties between the government and Indian tribes are guarantees. Guarantees should last. If you promise your neighbor you won't use the water from a pond on his property to irrigate your garden, you have given your word. If years later there's a drought and you begin to covet your neighbor's water and eventually go back on your word and take that water because your yard and garden are turning brown, what are you?

You are a liar, that's what you are.

In the end, I believe that most of the people who pule and whine about tribes -- and the abilities they have to harvest fish and game beyond what the rest of us can do -- are really just mad because someone gets to have more than we do.

No different than immature sixth-graders who believe the word "fair" is the same as "equal", when we all know that's not necessarily true.

Just shut up and fish.

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How fair was it when we took their land in exchange for the reservations and a few hunting and fishing rights? I'd say "something" doesn't need to be done. It's already been done.

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Are we going to take this all the way back to Plymouth Rock?

Or are we going to recognize that the tribes land boundrys where ever changing due to waring between themselves long before the white man got here.

White men where just another tribe that fought for the same land and won. Todays people should not be held responsible for what was the way of the west no matter how improper it seems now.

The Souix took land, the Chippewa took back land and so on and so on for many generations, one day a bigger stronger tribe showed up and wanted the same land. the rest is history.

If you dig into it a little you'll find out just how brutal and unforgiving the tribes where during their struggles for the same land we now live on.

How sad that for some the war is still on.

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We can argue and debate this for another hundred years but I personally do not see anything changing. One can also call ones Senators as this is a federal issue but somehow the judges will decide and they have already spoken. Until we change the Supreme Court Judges, nothing will likely change and we cannot change the judges by vote.

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Just my 2 cents worth and i don't wanna start anything, nut I also heard that in the treaty they agreed to back in 1854 or 1862 or whatever it was, it was also stated that 3 or more native americans in a group constituted a war party and could be shot.. Hence if we have to follow their treaty are we allowed to REALLY follow it?

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I have tried to learn as much about this issue and i have found out a few things. first, it is not an "anything goes" in the Ceded territory. It appears to be highly monitored by the tribes. second, it sounds like they have these rights at the pleasure of the president. thats the way i read it. i do not want our government to go back on its word, i just hope the tribes use good conservation and dont turn Mille lacs into Red Lake 2. still, i wonder if there is not a little "lets stick this to the white man" thinking behind this. i hope the fish and the treaty are not being used by the tribe to beat up the white man today for the sins of their fathers

i also dont consider people who are concerned about the health of the fisheries in the lakes in the ceded territory whiners.

lastly, isnt Mille lacs still considered a premeire walleye lake??? In fact, isnt it like number one?

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Just my 2 cents worth and i don't wanna start anything

Then Dont? wink

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I agree with loonasea, if were gonna follow the treaty, then lets FOLLOW it!

The american indians are gonnna take the country back without firing a shot. One casino at a time.

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Quote:
still, i wonder if there is not a little "lets stick this to the white man" thinking behind this. i hope the fish and the treaty are not being used by the tribe to beat up the white man today for the sins of their fathers

No, they are just sticking with in their legal rights and privileges, like I do with my rights as an MN angler. Its what our courts gave the tribes and what our country gave to them in the treaty. I am sure there is a violator or two like there is with regular MN anglers, but in a whole I feel most stay with in their legal rights. Its kind of like a using the speed limits. Why drive 30 in a 55mph zone. I have the right to slow down and know there are some benefits to doing it, but most times I drive right at 55mph and across the board, there are some who will do 80mph in a 55mph.

.

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If they can have there old treaty, why can't we have the old fishing regulations back, then we can all bleed this lakes dry. Then there won't be any fish for ether of us. If we have to adapt to lower fish limits and slots then they should also have to, it's up to the generations of today to manage the fishery for the children of tomorrow.

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The american indians are gonnna take the country back without firing a shot. One casino at a time.

I would not say they have or will ever have that kind of power.

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Shackbash, I do not understand your statement that this is a federal issue so contacting your rep's will not make a difference. You do know that we elect state AND federal pol's don't you? And the last time I checked we are still the "United States of America".

The one thing I do not want to do is make this a Native vs non native discussion because that is not what it really is. It should be a discussion of what is best for the lake and many, many people believe strongly that tribal netting is bad the the lake in the long run and they should have very right to express this opinion if they so wish with out being told your voice does not count so "shut up and live with it"

As for the Supreme court. The treaty decision was a 5/4 split decision so it was in no way a slam dunk. Also there is a different court today than then and I believe the present court would not come to the same decision as the last one.

Anyone can do a little checking and find out that treaty rights are being challenged all over the country right now and with some success I might add.

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From what I have read, and I have read quite a few Treaties, the hope was for all people, regardless of stripe, to blend and unite. The treaties were designed as a relatively short term objective to prevent culture shock, a soft landing so to speak. I agree with Blarkey, why not go back to the days when there were no regulations at all? Well, the answer is obvious.

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