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Coach1310

If Michigan and Florida counted???

79 posts in this topic

I heard something on the radio today that got me thinking... some political analyst was saying that if Michigan and Florida's delegates were counted that Hillary would be leading Obama in delegates right now. Is this true? If so, why would she drop out? I mean, all these people will be voting come November and it will count won't it? Just curious as to the details/accuracy of what I heard.

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The democratic party is already on the brink of collapse given all the B$ that has gone on lately. If they count Michigan and Florida, and Hillary wins, you will see a meltdown.

At this point, I don't believe that either Hillary or Obama can win the general election, so whatever happens is absolutely AOK with me.

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You heard correctly, kinda. First things first; Michigan and Florida had their delegate votes suspended because they moved up their primaries after the DNC told them not to. Now, Hillary still campaigned in Florida and Obama did not, so to say she won is a little disingenuous. But aside from all of that, Hillary can not run as a democrat in November unless she gets the required delegate votes, which she won't. The only chance she has is if the DNC changes their mind and counts the Michigan and Florida primaries. That's a lost cause however as the DNC hates the Clinton's. Now Hillary could run in November as an Independent but that would be the kiss of death for both Clinton and Obama and McCain would skate into the White House.

It should be fun grin.gif

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 Originally Posted By: Kidd
You heard correctly, kinda. First things first; Michigan and Florida had their delegate votes suspended because they moved up their primaries after the DNC told them not to. Now, Hillary still campaigned in Florida and Obama did not, so to say she won is a little disingenuous. But aside from all of that, Hillary can not run as a democrat in November unless she gets the required delegate votes, which she won't. The only chance she has is if the DNC changes their mind and counts the Michigan and Florida primaries. That's a lost cause however as the DNC hates the Clinton's. Now Hillary could run in November as an Independent but that would be the kiss of death for both Clinton and Obama and McCain would skate into the White House.

It should be fun grin.gif

I was gonna say the same thing about Obama not campaigning in those states,I rarely here that. I cant see how anybody could overlook that and expect those delagates to count. Obama under estamated The Clintons on that one. Im sure the Clintons had this in mind. We havnt heard the last of this.Would'nt be surprised The Clintons making a huge stink over this in june.And bring the party further down.

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Well if anyone can loose a sure thing it's the DNC. Bush was ripe for the pick'ns last election and the DNC sent Kerry. sick.gif

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They've made their own rules and now complain when the results have negative effects.

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 Originally Posted By: Lip_Ripper Guy
The democratic party is already on the brink of collapse given all the B$ that has gone on lately. If they count Michigan and Florida, and Hillary wins, you will see a meltdown.

At this point, I don't believe that either Hillary or Obama can win the general election, so whatever happens is absolutely AOK with me.

lol !!

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 Originally Posted By: croixflats
I was gonna say the same thing about Obama not campaigning in those states,I rarely here that.

Good thing she beat everyone on the MI ballot. Oh wait... grin.gif

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Ever heard of "Operation Chaos"?

I think its working and I think its hilarous.

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 Originally Posted By: Kidd
Well if anyone can loose a sure thing it's the DNC. Bush was ripe for the pick'ns last election and the DNC sent Kerry. sick.gif

no kidding. if the DNC cannot even beat someone like GWB, who can they beat. if you want to know why the Democrats held the WH only twice since 1968, its because they run candidates like the 2 this year. they never learn crazy.gif.

i see an ad for the Incredible Hulk movie. didnt they just have a movie like that that flopped??

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 Originally Posted By: Wade Joseph
Ever heard of "Operation Chaos"?

I think its working and I think its hilarous.

Yup!!! grin.gif

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The DNC has basicaly ruined any chance of being respected this year. Disallowing mich and fl because they do not play by the rules set by the DNC. Wow, Im taking my candidates and going home. Then they whip out super delegates to muddy the water further. Can you say voters be dammed we want Barack. Im almost, repeat almost, rooting for HRC to take Barak to the convention just to show the leaders of the party what fools they are. By the time the convention is over there will be many perterbed people who will hoperfuly make some huge changes in the party.

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On coverage of Indiania after the fact,the next day Tim Russert and ?? were discussing Florida and Mich.Russert said now even if the two were counted Hillery would be behind cause Obama would definitely get some Delegates and his lead this late cant be overtaken.I also just heard there's talk of Hillery for VP with Obama,

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I do not know how Michigan could be put in play. Obama was not even on the ballot - so to include MI would just no be right, however, we are talking about the DNC

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The DNC made the right call. The delegates won't be seated until the nomination is settled, then they'll seat them & do something to make nobody happy, like splitting them evenly or something.

Basically these two states chose to ignore the DNC rules, i.e. they wanted to keep Iowa & New Hampshire first &, if you choose to ignore rules on how early you can run a primary/caucus, we'll strip you of your delegates. I know what happens to me, & to all of you, when we ignore the rules. We get punished.

If I lived in one of these two states I'd be royally P.O.ed at the state leaders who let this happen. Morons.

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 Originally Posted By: Maximum12

If I lived in one of these two states I'd be royally P.O.ed at the state leaders who let this happen. Morons.

Well Max, in the case of Florida there wasn't much the Dem leaders could do. Apparently what happened was the Florida lawmakers (controlled by the Repubs) passed a law mandating the early primary. The Florida Dems couldn't do a thing to stop it, and the DNC basically said "tough noogies".

I've got to tell you - this Dem food-fight is the most political entertainment we've had in a loooooong while! You've got Barack Hussein Obama and Billary beating the flying bejeebers out of each other, while Rush and others snipe away gleefully from the right. Your average political junkies sit back with jaws open and tears of mirth streaming down our cheeks.

Meanwhile, McCain quietly rests up and prepares for the bare-knuckle brawl that's sure to follow.

Kind of off-topic Max, but I'm curious what you think the Dem strategy for attacking McCain will be. Obviously he's going to be tough to paint as a "far-right conservative".

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 Quote:
what you think the Dem strategy for attacking McCain will be

Hmmmmmm....I wonder what it'll be whistle.gif

145345.jpg

Jeez, what are McCains flip flops made out of....Mammoth hide? ;\)

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 Originally Posted By: Maximum12
The DNC made the right call. The delegates won't be seated until the nomination is settled, then they'll seat them & do something to make nobody happy, like splitting them evenly or something.

Basically these two states chose to ignore the DNC rules, i.e. they wanted to keep Iowa & New Hampshire first &, if you choose to ignore rules on how early you can run a primary/caucus, we'll strip you of your delegates. I know what happens to me, & to all of you, when we ignore the rules. We get punished.

If I lived in one of these two states I'd be royally P.O.ed at the state leaders who let this happen. Morons.

But who "broke the rules"? Not the people of those two states, but they are paying the price because it's their constitutional right to vote that is being trampled on. The democrats complained about disenfranchised voters in 2000 and a stolen Presidency, but now they are the ones not counting votes.

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Jackpine, interesting, I hadn't heard that about Florida, I'm going to have to go snorkeling the 'net for details now.

And as for the Democrats strategy on McCain, Duffman's beautiful picture made me laugh out loud. That's exactly it. They'll try to use every unpopular, unwise, unintelligent thing Bush has done in the past 8 years & try to tie it around McCain's neck. Guilt by association. If the DFL can't pull that off, after also failing to beat Bush in '04, they should really disband & start a new political movement...

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I just find it funny that they would "disallow" or not count a couple states. They must have figured they wouldn't matter in the overall nomination. Seems funny that a party will decide a candidate without taking into account all the states/voters. Maybe they will figure something out so the can't vote in November too!!! Nice to see the Dems still running in circles when the election should have been easy pickins!! Thanks for the info everyone.

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Being a diehard Dem, and a local insider, to the MN DFL party, I very reluclently have to agree with some of what some of you are saying. I equake it to the Vikings - LOL - we always seem to beat ourselves. \:o

There are specific reasons for why the Dems did what they did concerning MI and FL. And I personally don't agree with it.

The super Delegates and how all the primaries and cacuses are set up, nation wide for both parties, is a joke.

I believe in the ideals of the Dem. party but do wish they could get there [Admin Note: Please read forum policy before posting again]together.

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What we're seeing is the discontent and the splitting of the Democrats into two factions, Clinton representing the traditional blue collar, union type Dem, and Obama representing the wealthy "limousine liberal" type Dem. And worst of all, the Dems put Howard Dean in control of the DNC and this guy has no control over anything that is happening. He has no respect among the leaders (Gore, Kennedy etc...)and cannot resolve this campaign issue.

Look at the Republicans, as soon as Mitt Romney saw he was not going to win the nomination, he dropped out and left it to McCain and Huckabee, which made it easier to decide a winner early on. And once Huckabee was eliminated he threw his support behind McCain. Clinton can not win the nomination unless she can convince the super delegates to vote for her, and that's not going to happen, yet she continues to drain Obamas resources on getting the nomination as opposed to allowing the obvious winner, Obama, to campaign against McCain.

I too, side with the Democrats way of thinking but I have to tell ya, that party is screwed up.

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I agree with others, I don't think it will matter who the Dems throw on the ballot. It clearly should be Obama he will have the lead in delegates,popular vote,and number of states won. Either way I think McCain will win. He will be (already is) attacked by the Dems as a Bush bobo. Only the far left will buy that though. The Repubs are getting united and McCain has a strong independent following as well. The Democrats no matter how it shakes out are not going to be united. The only chance they would have is to have hillbillary as the veep and after this knock down drag out I doubt it.

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Thats funny I had read an article that stated she was far behind in pop vote....

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