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    • Rick

      Members Only Fluid Forum View   08/08/2017

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TNFL

Not using fuses ??? (on-board charger)

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Are fuses necessary on an on board charger?  Manual chargers do not have them,  is there a reason for them on the on board charges.

I was given a system with a bank that may not have been working correctly, possibly blowing the fuse repeatedly.  My system would not be hooked up to an alternator on the engine so I'm wondering if it is fine to use the charging bank without the fuses. 

The orange charging light comes on when I hook the wires directly up to a battery.

I'm asking because I don't want to go through the bother of wiring this thing in my boat if I can't get it to work right.

Also, I would technically only need 2 of the 3 banks to work, but I like the idea of repairing it to its potential.

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Any type of charging/starting systems should ALWAYS be fused. Basic wiring 101. If not, and you fry the he** out of something, no complaints are allowed.

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So what could fry?

I'm talking about charging a battery with nothing connected to it.

not trying to be a smartie, just looking for all the info.

could the battery explode, etc?

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Chargers can short circuit, and fry themselves. Seen it happen. You may not be old enough to remember, but cars in the 60's-70's had voltage regulators (not internal alternator ones like now) that would short and fry...and sometimes you got lucky and they stopped working before yer battery boiled itself to death. Same thing If you blow a fuse between batt and charging source, then in effect, no charge going anywhere, and nothing gets fried or overcooked. For a $1.99 inline fuse assy, why not??

fuse.jpg

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I'm not opposed to replacing the broken or malfunctioning fuses.

But I was under the impression from the guy that gave me the minnkota charger that 1 of the 3 banks was "bad". But when I hook it up to a battery without fuses it seems to work.  So I'm trying to trouble shoot this thing and see if his version of "bad" meant it was repeatedly blowing the fuse(s).  Might be a glitch in the charger...or a serious problem.

That guy has some electrical college schooling in his back ground, so I'm assuming the issue wasn't that he was too dumb or lazy to replace fuses.

but he also has a nice ranger and doesn't want to risk damaging his equipment.

I hooked it up straight to a battery with no fuses earlier tonight, and it charged it fine.  I also did not have any equipment hooked to the battery at the same time.

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It's your battery and charger. Whatever works for ya. This is the prime example why I no longer give engine advice. I spent tons of money and schooling getting certified and many years working on building/tuning/racing engines, and folks ask for free advice, then don't like it and don't want to follow it. Same reason I no longer help the neighbors with their lawnmowers, snowblowers, cars, etc.No disrespect or smart-one-just-like-silly-me dump meant towards you here. They key phrase in yer narrative was  "with a bank that may not have been working correctly, possibly blowing the fuse repeatedly". That means who knows what is wrong to me.  I hope ya figure things out and it works out well for you.

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Thanks, for the advice.

I guess my nature isn't just to hear "do this or do that" but i like to try to understand why, or what could happen.

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48 minutes ago, TNFL said:

Thanks, for the advice.

I guess my nature isn't just to hear "do this or do that" but i like to try to understand why, or what could happen.

And that makes a whale of a lot of sense. Too many poke around in the dark without a clue.....

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How is the any different from the manual charger I hook-up that has no fuse...?

Obviously all of my lights, electronics, tilt/trim, etc are fused up.  But the charger itself ain't.  

 

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Just out of curiosity, what kind of charger is it (brand, model, etc)?   Is it even repairable?  Or is it potted in epoxy, full of integrated circuits, etc?

Possibly blowing fuses?  Which fuses located where?  

To satisfy some curiosity, I looked at the manual (RTFM as we used to say) for an onboard minnkota precision digital charger.   Here is a quote.....

Quote

INLINE FUSE
Each output cord has inline fuses on the RED and BLACK leads located near the ring terminals. These fuses serve as protection
from surges and short circuits caused by a damaged charger output cable. If a fuse blows, replace it with a 30 amp ATC 32V
automotive fuse. Improper battery connections will normally not cause a fuse to blow since this is handled by the internal
circuitry of the charger.

They incorporate fuses at the factory so it seems that it is a good idea to do so if the charger in question doesn't have them.   They also say to not shorten the output leads but leave them full length of 6 feet. 

So I vote for fuses.   They won't hurt anything, and could prevent a mess if something happens to the wiring.   (Internal to the charger, the printed wiring would probably protect the fuse by blowing first  (geek humor)

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10 hours ago, bobbymalone said:

How is the any different from the manual charger I hook-up that has no fuse...?

Obviously all of my lights, electronics, tilt/trim, etc are fused up.  But the charger itself ain't.  

 

Only reason I said to ADD ONE INLINE is the fact that there IS something wrong with it already blowing fuses....mine has a fuse protected circuit with a reset button. Who knows if his is even functioning...if it has one at all?

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And, Bobby, the difference is that the wires to your manual unit are, presumably, out in the open where they wouldn't get damaged in a manner that you couldn't see.   

An onboard charger is hidden and so are the wires, laying around under the deck where they could get worn or damaged by other stuff down there.  

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Delcecchi,

It is the Minnkota MK-330.

The fuses on the bank in question were located at the ends of both leads as described in your post.

It was given to me because I only use 2 batteries in my boat.  My Minnkota is the highest LB thrust that you can get away with only using one 12 volt battery.

I'm going to try and reinstall the fuses on the bank in question, if it doesn't work i won't use it.

I was just hoping to have a back up, in case another bank went bad when i was out of town or whatever.  I guess I will just always bring my manual charger as a back up.

 

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So, did you have the fuses blow?  Trying to think what would make the blow if the wires are ok.   Maybe the output of the charger on that bank is shorted?    Have you checked it?

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Are the correct size fuses being put back in if/when they blow? I believe those should be 10 amp fuses. You could try putting something higher in there like a 15 if the 10 keeps blowing. I wouldn't go much higher than that. Other option would be to replace that lead and put a new inline fuse in there. I have essentially the same charger. Over time they tend to go to pot.

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1 hour ago, CaptainMusky said:

Are the correct size fuses being put back in if/when they blow? I believe those should be 10 amp fuses. You could try putting something higher in there like a 15 if the 10 keeps blowing. I wouldn't go much higher than that. Other option would be to replace that lead and put a new inline fuse in there. I have essentially the same charger. Over time they tend to go to pot.

That is a good point.  Previous owner could have blown a fuse for unknown reasons and replaced with wrong size....

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On 8/30/2017 at 8:41 AM, CaptainMusky said:

Are the correct size fuses being put back in if/when they blow? I believe those should be 10 amp fuses. You could try putting something higher in there like a 15 if the 10 keeps blowing. I wouldn't go much higher than that. Other option would be to replace that lead and put a new inline fuse in there. I have essentially the same charger. Over time they tend to go to pot.

I'm not sure I would just arbitrarily put in the next bigger fuse. Find out what is recommended by the manufacturer and use that. If it continues to blow, there's a problem that needs to be resolved and a larger fuse is not the correct solution.

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"Chargers with a yellow fuse holder use a 30 amp AGX 32V automotive fuse. An AGC can be used but may not fit as well as the AGX. Chargers with a red fuse holder use a 30 amp ATC 32V automotive fuse. "

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