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Adam NWI

Hydraulic Frames

81 posts in this topic

Sorry if this has been discussed before, I wasn't able to find anything through a quick search.  I'm looking to start a new fish house build and wondering what everyone's thoughts were on Tebben frames.  I like the idea of how they raise the tongue of the trailer keeping the hitch level.  My current trailer binds up on the ball when it's lowered making it difficult to disconnect from my truck.

My main concerns are if I can get it galvanized and if there were any added charges for that.  Also, do these come with trailer brakes built in, or would I have to add those myself?  From what I've seen online, correct me if I'm wrong, trailer brakes are required on trailers with a gross weight of 3000# or more in Iowa and Minnesota.  With a frame weight of 1780#, I'm assuming I'll go over 3000# pretty quickly.

I'm planning to build a 20' house with steel 1x1" square tubing for the studs.  My first build was a 6-1/2x10' plus a 3'v.  It still works great, I just enjoy the project almost as much as I enjoy fishing out of it and I'm ready for an upgrade!

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I have a Berkon galvanized hydraulic frame, that I like. Easy to connect/disconnect from truck in either up or down position. Haven't had any experience with a Tebben frame.

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Thanks for the reply trav102, the Berkon frame looks pretty similar to the Tebben and it looks like they do galvanized trailers pretty regularly.

Did yours come with trailer brakes?  Or is that something I'd have to add on myself if I go over 3000#?

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Sorry I forgot to add, I didn't build on this one, already came built so the brakes were on already. (I built my last one however) But I did look at the Berkon frames before I bought because I was going to build again myself and pretty sure that they had the brakes already. (At least the ones I looked at in their catalog) But I feel like any brand at that size should come with the brakes already, since a 20' house is going to go over the 3k limit.

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I was thinking the same thing, but when I don't see it listed with the features I don't want to go off my own assumption.

I sent Tebben a couple emails 2 days ago and hadn't heard anything yet.  I'll give Berkon a try and see what they say.

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If Lip_Ripper Guy doesn't come on about your frame just PM him, he's our resident expert on hydraulic frames. 

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I was looking to buy a frame from this guy http://www.fishhouse-frames.com/node

but it was out of my price range. He said he can weld on the axle arms after the galvanize. If you have not talked with the galvanizer yet I suggest you do. If your going to use AZZ galvanize out of winstead MN, Dan the sales guy is great to deal with and will explain everything you need to know.

Moon Lake Refuge likes this

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That's who we used vtx and he was great to work with.  Easiest part of the whole build.  Question on the studs though.  1x1?  That doesn't leave a lot for insulation unless your going with some substantial furring strips.

vtx1029 likes this

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I use 1x4's as furring strips, which will give me another 3/4".  Then having it spray foamed.

My last house I used rigid foam boards for insulation in the walls and ceiling.  I've never had anything spray foamed before, so if that's not enough let me know what you think.

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9 minutes ago, Adam NWI said:

I use 1x4's as furring strips, which will give me another 3/4".  Then having it spray foamed.

My last house I used rigid foam boards for insulation in the walls and ceiling.  I've never had anything spray foamed before, so if that's not enough let me know what you think.

I would say 1x4 is over kill for furring strips aside from where bunks and cabinets are located and 1x1 is under sized for the studs.  Personally I would run 1x2 to have enough room for insulation.  Couple bucks extra up front. It saves you from hearing your furnace as often and spending as much down the road on propane.  

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Planned on cutting the 1x4's down into 1x2's as I don't need 3-1/2" wide furring strips.  These would give me a thickness of 1-3/4" to insulate.  I thought that would be more than what Ice Castle uses.  I think they use 2x2" wood studs which would have actual depth of about 1-1/2".  I may be wrong there as I don't know for sure what they use for studs.

The reason I was going with 1x1" square tubing was to keep the weight down, but with 1x2", I could go with a lighter gauge steel, which would only be a little heavier overall.

I was going with 14 ga. steel for the 1x1's, may change it to 16 ga if I use 1x2's.  What gauge and widths has everyone else used?

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In case anyone was wondering the same thing, I just got word back from Berkon, and all of their tandem axle trailers do come standard with trailer brakes. 

One less thing on the to-do list!

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Last I talked with Tebben they weren't galvanizing frames.  That may have changed in the last few months.

Regardless of manufacturer, galvanizing is a substantial up-charge, but worth it ($600-1,000).  No coating any manufacturer is currently doing last more than a couple years.  Paint, powder coating, and bed liner are all going to end up rusty in a very short time.   

Don't use 14 gauge for your studs.  Use 16 or less, if you can find it.  1x1 is probably fine, but I've not seen it used.  You'll get a lot more strength from something rectangular shaped, but added strength may not be necessary.  1x1 will already be stronger than any wood stud.    

Edit to add:

I know nothing about the manufacturer page you cited, but their prices are in line with all the other hydraulic frame manufacturers.  

Edited by Lip_Ripper Guy

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Thanks Lip Ripper, I used a mix of 14 and 16 gauge 1x1 on my last house.  I used 14 gauge in the corners and V as well as the studs holding up the bunks.  That probably wasn't necessary.

I wouldn't mind using 2x1, but doesn't that cover up the entire outer tube on the frame?  What supports your plywood floor around the edges?

I know exactly what you mean with the galvanizing being worth it.  We build park equipment and always recommend galvanizing over any other finish for the durability.

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18 hours ago, Adam NWI said:

Thanks Lip Ripper, I used a mix of 14 and 16 gauge 1x1 on my last house.  I used 14 gauge in the corners and V as well as the studs holding up the bunks.  That probably wasn't necessary.

I wouldn't mind using 2x1, but doesn't that cover up the entire outer tube on the frame?  What supports your plywood floor around the edges?

I know exactly what you mean with the galvanizing being worth it.  We build park equipment and always recommend galvanizing over any other finish for the durability.

The bottom (and top) plate(s) of your wall are stood on end.   

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Thanks Lip Ripper, I've looked at a couple of your builds on this page and I never would have noticed that!

I've never seen a fish house in my area as the closest lake safe to drive on in the winter is an hour and a half away, so I definitely appreciate all the help I can get from the experts!!!

 

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I finally decided on a frame and have it ordered.  Now I'm working to get everything else ordered so I can start framing up the walls.  One thing I'm having trouble deciding on are the doors and windows.  Is there a special kind needed for traveling down the highway, or will any glass slider work from one of the home improvement stores?  Where has everyone gotten theirs from?  Fishhouse supply has one, but from the looks of it only one size.

 

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1 hour ago, Adam NWI said:

I finally decided on a frame and have it ordered.  Now I'm working to get everything else ordered so I can start framing up the walls.  One thing I'm having trouble deciding on are the doors and windows.  Is there a special kind needed for traveling down the highway, or will any glass slider work from one of the home improvement stores?  Where has everyone gotten theirs from?  Fishhouse supply has one, but from the looks of it only one size.

 

Who did you end up going with for your frame?

 

You'll want to get an out swing fish house door.  You can do some online searches for camper doors, rv doors, etc. to track them down.

 

A regular house window is by far the best option.  Menards has some good options, especially with the Jeld Wen's.  

Moon Lake Refuge likes this

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Good advice!  Thanks Hawg!  I ordered a Berkon 8x21' galvanized hydraulic frame.  After looking into each of the manufacturers that I know of, that came to be my first choice.  It turns out he had one in stock, and I can pick it up this weekend!

 

My original plan was to get the rest of the materials together while waiting on the frame.  Now that will all have to be pushed up.  Can't complain about that!

 

Lip Ripper, I was hoping you would say that about the windows.  Hopefully I can get to Menards sometime this weekend and look around.

 

My steel 2x1 stud order is in.  I've just got to wait for our production dept. to get their tubing orders in so I don't have to pay freight.  Should get that in early next week I hope.  I'm excited to get the process started!

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LRG has said it in other posts but after nearing the end of our build I couldn't agree more.  Order everything you will need for the house, down to the screws and all.  We spent more time waiting and shopping once we were building than I would want to do again.  Hard part can be not knowing what all you'll need but its definitely a PITA having to stop to go spend 10 bucks on screws or something else.

Adam NWI and Lip_Ripper Guy like this

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I'm having a little trouble finding 5/16" pine carsiding.  It's not on Menards page and the guys I've talked to at two different stores say they can't even order it.

 

I tried Lowes, which has it listed at $17.45 for a bundle of 6 on their page, but they don't have it in stock in their local store.  They told me I had to wait until today to talk to their specialist to see if they could order it in.  Still, 17.45 seems a little high for (6) 5/16" pine carsiding boards. 

 

Where has everyone else gotten it, and are there better prices out there?

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Thanks VTX!  That'll save me about $350!

 

I assume those come in bundles of 6 as well.  Their page description isn't very good.

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It is bundles of 6.

 

They used to do the buy 1 get 1 free, but I haven't seen that for a long time.  The best bet is to wait for an 11% off sale, and then don't forget to send in your rebate form.

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    • BEFORE BEGINNING

      Before you begin, make sure you have a good strong battery and make sure it's charged up. If you have a bad or weak battery, you may want to replace it because if it doesn't crank good and strong, you are likely to get a low, inaccurate reading. Make sure your engine is warmed up to operating temperature(if possible). About 10 minutes of riding should do.

      First, take out the spark plug and thread in the adapter for the compression tester. Make sure you have the correct size adapter for your particular ATV. Slide your kill switch to the "off" position. Some ATVs won't crank over with the kill switch in the "off" position, so if yours is like this, then you will need to either unhook your ignition coil or ground the end of the spark plug wire to a good ground. You can use a jumper wire with alligator clips on each end to ground it. Next, make sure the throttle is in the wide open position. You can either hold the throttle lever with your thumb or you may be able to tape it or use a zip tie to fasten it to your handlebars to hold it in the wide open position. If you don't have the throttle in the wide open position, you will probably get too low of a reading. Also, if you are testing a newly rebuilt engine, the engine needs to have been run for, at least, 30 or 40 minutes or you will probably get too low of a reading.

      NOTE: Before you begin with the actual test, make sure the threaded adapter is screwed in good and isn't leaking any air out around it.

      ACTUAL TESTING

      With the throttle in the wide open position, push the start button and crank the engine over until the hand on the gauge stops moving. Each time the engine turns over the hand should raise a little more until it reaches the maximum compression of the engine. When it stops, that is your compression reading. This usually takes no more than 10 seconds. Try to avoid cranking an engine for more than 10 seconds at a time as this is hard on the starter and the battery. Now, push the relief valve on your compression gauge and that will reset the hand back to zero. It's a good ideal to repeat the test a couple or three times to make sure you get an accurate reading. On kick start models, it will be the same procedure, but obviously you will be kicking it over instead of using a start button. Worn piston rings and cylinder walls will increase the number of strokes it takes to reach the maximum reading. If you're kicking, it could possibly take as many as 10-20 kicks to get the highest reading.

      THE READING

      You will need to check your repair manual for your particular model for the correct compression specifications. See note below. Usually, an engine will run OK if it has at least 100 PSI of compression. Most engines will have somewhere between 100-250 and some as high as 300 PSI, depending on the engine. Sometimes they will run with under 100 PSI, but usually not very well. If you get a low reading, you can do a "wet test" to try to help determine the problem.

      If your reading is too high, then you probably have carbon built up on your piston and combustion chamber.

      NOTE: You may get a low reading on some engines because some engines have a decompressor assembly built into the camshaft. Check the service manual for your quad to see whether or not your quad has a decompressor assembly built into the cam.

      WET TEST

      If you got a low reading, pour about 1-2 teaspoons of clean motor oil down into the cylinder through the spark plug hole and do the compression test again. If your reading increases, then your rings or cylinder walls are probably worn. If your reading doesn't increase, then it's probably your valves. You could have a bent valve, you may have leaky valve seats, or your valve clearance may not be adjusted properly. Also, low compression can be caused by a blown head gasket.

      CAUSES OF LOW COMPRESSION

      *Worn piston rings or worn or damaged cylinder walls
      *Leaking valves
      *Valve clearance not properly set
      *Blown head gasket

      CAUSE OF HIGH COMPRESSION (stock engines)

      *Carbon buildup in combustion chamber and on piston

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