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PierBridge

The Griz is not allowed to continue Guiding...

104 posts in this topic

... on the Mississippi River until he gets a Coast Guard 6 Pack guiding license!

Sounds like they are cracking down a bit more now on this requirement!

Law enforcement has notified the Griz and other River guides that they can be fined up to $10,000 per trip if they are caught guiding on the Mississippi River with-out the proper License.

The Griz has moved his guiding for the time being to the North Metro Lakes.

Griz isn't sure he will get the 6 Pack license mainly because of the difficulty, cost and the limited classes and venues available to get the License.

Any other FM guides effected by this and I would assume the Croix is included also?

Discuss!

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i think it is ridiculous, i dont know the details though. just seems like a way for the government to take more money, probably to pay the AIG guys or something. i have no faith in our government anymore. and i do understand how great of a life we live in in america(i just got back from a 30 hour bus ride from mexico on a missons trip), and it was amazing too see how content people are with so little and how much faith they have.

sorry to get off topic, i just think that some things need to be left alone, and although i have done no research or anything, this seems like something that should be left alone.

just let the guys try to make a living, and a lot of the river guides, such as the grizz know more than some "certified" people will ever know

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Thats a shame...

If anything, The Griz should be exempt or grandfathered in. wink

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Your right It seems like you can't make a HONEST living anymore without the govermenttelling you what to do or some .... bum sueing you for everything you got. In ways the poor people [non americans] have a richer life. They are proud of who they are and where they live. Something that seems like we all lost over time.

I don't know all the details on the Griz and the river but seems to me just another way to control ones life. What happened to free America.

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Yup, I am in the same boat.. Have to be a licensed captain here on Lake Superior. Lots of waterways are federally controlled and you need to be licensed, on some waters most guides dont even know about this. The Mississippi has long been held as a regulated waterway, and a license has always been needed for any boat for hire.

The class is costly and timely, plus insurance costs a bit more then a regular guide insurance package. Plus now, before getting your license, you have to pay another 100 some odd dollars for a TWIC card (Transportation Workers Identification Card). Then you need all your USCG approved equipment, etc, etc.

But, overall, I enjoyed taking the class and learning what I did. One plus, it does limit the number of (legal) operations in areas, because of what was stated.. the extra time and effort to be legal.

But, be warned if you are illegal with out a license on these waters and get in an accident or some other insurance related issue. You will be SOL without a commerical policy.

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I really feel for the guides and the inconvenience they are put through. I dont think its about the money but about safety.

It maybe some extra hoops and all but I sure feel more comfortable knowing these guides actually know something about being on the water they navigate.

It is a big responsibility to take putting a strangers life in your hands.

This is by no means me putting down guides as I am sure most guides know what they are doing but there are some people out there that say I think I will be a guide today how hard can it be.

I personaly dont think it is easy.

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Does this include ALL of the Miss. waters up through Brainerd or only because it's considered boarder waters with WI.?

mr

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...

Any other FM guides effected by this and I would assume the Croix is included also?

Discuss!

The USCG enforces the law, just as police officers do, these guys are just doing there job. Yes, the enforcement is coming on the St. Croix and Mississippi Rivers. Be prepared, I've been through the system and am licensed captain, if any of you need help send me a email at fish@croixsippi.com I'll try to help.

Turk

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Turk,

does this new law effect the whole stretch of the miss river up to Itasca?

mr

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Knowing that the LEGAL guides are licensed and have gone through the neccessary training should be reassuring to the rest of the folks using the water. It is all in the name of safety, and I see nothing wrong with it. They are not just trying to take away the money from those making it on the rivers and big lakes. More likely, they are trying to send a message to those who think it is all fun and games. Proper training and certification will keep the c-lister guides from charging 75 bucks to take you out in their boat for the night.

Just think, if you were in a guide's boat and saw someone else on the water that was in a life threatening situation, would you not feel more comfortable knowing that the person you are on the water with is trained and skillful enough to attempt a rescue? I'm not saying that they are obligated to do so, but it would certainly make me feel better about my trip.

These guys and gals put their lives into satisfying others day in and day out, all the while giving out tips on how to be more successful on the water. It is not an easy gig.

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So who is to say he is "guiding" and not just out fishing with a friend. Nudge, Nudge, wink, wink, say no more, say no more!

To take the river away from a river man is brutal. I say go fishing, then slip him $100.00 or whatever his fee is under the table at the bar later. The CO, or in this case the Coasties, can't tell the differance between a friend and a paying client right? As long as he still has other clients that are willing to fish the lakes so he can proove and income, for tax reasons....

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More and more regs on both sides of the border. It definately makes it tougher on everyone. Most of the laws are made up for the people that have no common sense and shouldn't be outy there anyway. My guess would be it will create alot more guys taking cash and under the table dealings. The idea of the rules make sense, bt how much will it really help in the name of safety. Most of the guys doing it for business are experienced and the safe ones on the water. It is the new recreational users that are the real safety hazards.

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This is the exact reason I dont guide on the St. Louis River. Its a joke if ya ask me. I could see if I chartered on Lake Superior but not on the river. Not worth the time, money, insurance costs etc. to me.

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By the sounds of the post I would say he is allowed if he would comply with the law, since he chooses not to, he isn't guiding those waters not that he isn't allowed too...

I have to agree with most I feel much better knowing a guide is fully licensed and insured incase something were to happen, it would be like going into a restaurant/bar not having a current licenses and insurance and then something happenend....I would think you would want them to be in compliance of the laws no matter what the business is

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So who is to say he is "guiding" and not just out fishing with a friend. Nudge, Nudge, wink, wink, say no more, say no more!

To take the river away from a river man is brutal. I say go fishing, then slip him $100.00 or whatever his fee is under the table at the bar later. The CO, or in this case the Coasties, can't tell the differance between a friend and a paying client right? As long as he still has other clients that are willing to fish the lakes so he can proove and income, for tax reasons....

I think I'd feel more comfortable going with a licensed guide knowing that he has insurance to cover me. Stuff can happen.

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So who is to say he is "guiding" and not just out fishing with a friend. Nudge, Nudge, wink, wink, say no more, say no more!

I know people that have been doing that for years on Lake Michigan. They just take out past clients and close personal friends. And they dont advertise. It's not uncommon.

Years of experience on the water is more valuable then a training class. UNLESS you are just starting out or only a few years into it.

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This is the exact reason I dont guide on the St. Louis River. Its a joke if ya ask me. I could see if I chartered on Lake Superior but not on the river. Not worth the time, money, insurance costs etc. to me.

I agree with this and here's where I have the problem with this law. You can guide pretty much anywhere in the MN on any lake without a license. I can see a need for it, but it shouldn't be $1,000 to get it either. The classes alone are $750 and you have to take off work as they are 56 hours mandatory. They you still have to pay for the licenses. Basically when you get this license you are pretty equal to a barge capt. What's the point of that? There are so many morans on that river in Pleasure boats that are 30 - 80 feet long that NEED to be licensed. I've seen more close calls from them than a person in an 18' fishing boat. Most fisherman, guide or not, are the responsible boaters out on the water. Not all, there are still knuckleheads.

I don't have a problem with the laws but $1000 to get into the license is a little steep.

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The law is the law whether you like it or not. I personally think all guides should be licensed and carry enough insurance to cover anything that might come up. IMO if you are making money on the waterway, it's no different than the guy making money on the highway. License, insurance and vehicle inspection anually, maybe throw in a physical and a urinallysis.

Yes, there are lots of bad and inconsiderate drivers on any water but the difference is someone is paying you, like a taxi driver, and they have a different lisense and set of rules to go by as well. Lets face it, many professions out there require a lisence, why not this one?

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I don't disagree with you mnfishinguy, but why would you not need a license on Mille Lacs? I don't know so I'm askin', do the charter boats on Mille Lacs need capt's licenses? If not, why? I would say it should be all over then, not just on a river.

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they should just make it a law that if you want to boat on the rivers than you need a coast guard certification not just impose this on the guides......also what can happen on guided trip that you would be worried about the guide having the proper insurance?? maybe I am missing something, well I must be missing something cause there is obviously insurance out there for the guide........and to who said they go into a bar/resteraunt that they are insured, How do you know that the insurance hasn't canceled-the licensed part should be up to date per the state but who is keeping an eye on them to make sure they are properly insured?

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Quote:
Knowing that the LEGAL guides are licensed and have gone through the neccessary training should be reassuring to the rest of the folks using the water. It is all in the name of safety, and I see nothing wrong with it. They are not just trying to take away the money from those making it on the rivers and big lakes. More likely, they are trying to send a message to those who think it is all fun and games. Proper training and certification will keep the c-lister guides from charging 75 bucks to take you out in their boat for the night.

Do you ever get a guide that is not on the river? They most likely aren't licensed as you don't need to be elsewhere in MN excpet Superior and a few other places. I doubt any of them go out and drop the grand to set folks' minds at ease. I haven't found any guides that are charging $75 yet. And if you are out there for fun and games you won't last long. I would say a percentage is knowing where you are fishing and getting fish all the time. Another huge part of it is your personality and people skills. You can catch fish all day long, but if you're an A$$ you aren't going to last long.

Quote:
Just think, if you were in a guide's boat and saw someone else on the water that was in a life threatening situation, would you not feel more comfortable knowing that the person you are on the water with is trained and skillful enough to attempt a rescue? I'm not saying that they are obligated to do so, but it would certainly make me feel better about my trip.

Personally, I think anyone who boats should have some basic skills in this area. I would like to think that I could be helped out by anyone on the water. May not be the case, but we should all have some of those skills.

Quote:
These guys and gals put their lives into satisfying others day in and day out, all the while giving out tips on how to be more successful on the water. It is not an easy gig.

Agreed, like I said, a part is the fishing. I have always found that most are there to learn tips, techniques and just have a good time. You have to make it fun and teach them areas, techniques or what not. It for sure is not a cake walk job because you know how to fish or everyone would be doing it.

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I guess I see it as there should be some middle ground. A fishing guide shouldn't need the same licensing as a barge driver and or tour boat operator, but he should know the laws of the river, first aid and all safety regulations.

How about a specific certification for fishing guides? A little less regulatory and a little less money.

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I guess I see it as there should be some middle ground. A fishing guide shouldn't need the same licensing as a barge driver and or tour boat operator, but he should know the laws of the river, first aid and all safety regulations.

How about a specific certification for fishing guides? A little less regulatory and a little less money.

I agree 100% with you Darrin. That sounds more reasonable to me.

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Hmmm? middle ground, reasonable, qualifications to navigate the high seas. The Government.

Asking alot but great thoughts grin

Just pointing out the obvious that we all know with a shot at humour.

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