Guests - If You want access to member only forums on HSO. You will gain access only when you sign-in or Sign-Up on HotSpotOutdoors.

It's easy - LOOK UPPER right menu.

Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
fishersofmen

Boy forced to get kemo

197 posts in this topic

Well the 13 year old boy in southern MN was forced to go to the doctor. I think it is a total shame for government to get involved in something like this. Let parents be parents and step aside. We all disagree with the way people do things but in the end life is about choices and God intended for everyone to be able to make there own. Apparently the mother and boy didn't show up for court today and they have now issued a warrant for her arrest. As soon as they show up the boy will be taken into state custody and she will probably be arrested. This is embarrassing for America and a total assult on our freedom as individuals.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That kid should be taken away from his parents and put in protective custody. I read that he is home schooled and can't even read at age 13. He is not getting a fair chance at life. Both parents should be arrested.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll second that Catfish.

And a third.

Judging by the initial post, you'd think this is the first time the government (oh my gosh I said it!) stepped in to help kids who can't help themselves.

This kid needs help, I just hope they can find him now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know if having the Goverment decide all family issues is the best thing to happen.

Wait until the press makes this their #1 story. Boy will they slam the family as they are criminals for wanting to take care of their child their own way.

I'm sure the stories will really be full of it as the better the story, the more all will listen.

This boys life is in God's hands and I'm sure He can take care of it. I sure would believe God can do a better job than our Goverment. They mess everything else up so why not a family.

I wonder if the family also never fed him?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As much as I agree that the government shouldn't step in on family issues, I think this is differnt.

This kid has never known anything but what his parents tell him and in effect they have brainwashed him into thinking this is the right way to go. Obviously they have strong feelings against modern medicine, but I can't see loosing a child to be a better option than bending on your religious beleifs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Originally Posted By: norm25
I'll second that Catfish.

And a third.

4th here. Again another reason that some people just shouldn't have kids...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, people should not have kids if they believe in something different than the general public.

Hilter also wanted to control Germany and many other countries and they needed to follow what he thought was correct.

There is more than one way to cure an illness.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I side with taking the kid away and getting him the treatment he needs. I would also be looking at the remainder of the family and determine if the other 7 kids are also in the same boat. Can any of them read or write or is it just this one?

Whether anyone wants to swallow their pride and admit the government is actually right for once in forcing the family to get him the coverage he needs, this is simply the right choice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is more than one way to cure an illness.

And it's been proven the familie's chosen method isn't working.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right, if their choice of treatment would be working or have an equal or close chance of curing his illness I would take no issue.

But that isn't the case, get this kid the treatment he deserves and ten years down the road he will be glad the government stepped in and he isn't pushing up daisys someplace.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's sad this kid believes what his parents are doing for him is right and now it will kill him. He obviously doesn't know any better.

I can throw the kids in the backseat of the truck and fly down the road at 100 mph drunk and I will get thrown in jail for negligence and child endagerment. Why should this be any different. When someone's life is at stake, I'm all for the government stepping in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In reading the news articles on this, I have to agree with the judge. When the boy was interviewed, he had no understanding that he is even ill. He said he was a medicine man according to this tribe they claim to be a part of, yet he has no idea how he got to be a medicine man. He cannot read, and apparently could not understand the pros and cons of treatment. Interestingly, the dad is now saying that his son should be taken to a doctor for a reevaluation.

The parents claim to be Roman Catholics, but also associate themselves with what is basically a cult type belief system where they base their healing on Native American methods.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This boys life is in God's hands and I'm sure He can take care of it. I sure would believe God can do a better job than our Goverment. They mess everything else up so why not a family.

I beleave your right harvey lee. I just wonder who gave us the means to possibly fight cancer?? God???? When people say ,"Well its in Gods hands now", Isn't it all in Gods hands all the time? Didn't he give us everything?? Including a possible cure for cancer??? I hear what your saying and I as well as you I'm sure, was always taught to thank God for ALL his gifts. God helps those that help themselves. It looks to me like these people don't want to even try help themselves..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They are fugitives now, failing to show up in court. Arrest Warrants have been issued.

So where does it go from here ? Manhunt for the mother leads to high speed chase and crash that kills them both. Who is at fault

then ? Pushing to far.

Leave them alone to find their own way, I would do the same thing

even if I don`t believe in any church or religion. Its their choice and nobody is respecting it.

I am sure the father knows where they are and won`t tell. They received many calls from doctors around the country to treat the kids cancer for free not involving chemo treatments.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So you think folks should be free to cause their kids to die because of their insane beliefs? Have you read up on this case? And Hodgkins Lymphoma?

How about prayer to cure pneumonia?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let the family have their way. Their way is not going to shorten my lifespan any.

I see it as Darwinism in action.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I disagree Jameson, this kid isn't making his own choices and can't make his own choices. I know first hand. We took in a now 12 year old that we are adopting. She THINKS she knows what she needs and how things should work. Kids have no clue. She broke her leg three weeks ago and didn't want surgery because she "didn't want a scare". Should I have said, well cool, you can just hobble around then?

This kids tumor has grown so what the parents are doing isn't working. They are putting the kids life in danger and that is the main reason children are taken out of their home.

I don't like gov't in control of much of anything, but in this case you need to remove the kid from the home and give him a chance at life.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And what if he dies from the kemo that is forced on him like thousands of others have. Many, many times it is the kemo that kills cancer patients not the cancer. I would then sue the pants off of the state government. Its funny how everyone and there cousin calls themself a Christian. Yet when it comes down to it very, very few would have enough Faith in God to put their own child in His hands before the hands of the the corrupt, money drivin medical field. Jesus Christ has healed the sick and He still does. But todays motto is God last if everything else has failed, not God first. People should have the choice to take matters to the Creator of all things before a doctor who has been trained by man if that is what they choose. Also isn't this the same state where a 13 year old girl can get an abortion without parental notification, because she alone has the right of choice concerning her body? So a 13 year old alone can choose to end a life that is inside her, but another one who stands by his parents beliefs will get pinned down to a table and injected in order to save his???????

On a side note, does everyone actually think the medical field and the drug companies want to cure cancer? Do you realize the billions of dollars doctors and drug copmanies make off of cancer? Can you imagine how many tens of thousands of jobs would be lost if cancer was cured? If you think it is all good intentions in the medical society and all they want to do is heal everyone in the country so they can no longer exsist you would be extremely nieve. I should have the right to view the medical field for what it is and I should also have the right to put my trust and faith in the Lord to heal me and my kids. God doesn't choose to heal everyone including some young people and He has His reasons for that. But that doesn't mean that He has failed, or even that the person has failed themselves or their children for believing in Him. That is just life my friends......

P.S I don't know the exact details of this case and what exactly the parents are thinking and where they are at mentaly, mainly just trying to make a point here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've got a nephew who went through this 2 years ago and thank God there was never a question about treatment because you can't wait.

Bottom line is this:

No chemo, 95% chance that boy dies.

Chemo, 95% chance he lives.

I think the odds speak for themselves.

DD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The odds do speak for themselves. That doesn't mean the government should order parents to allow their children to live.

Right?

God forbid. As though anyone posting on these boards is arrogant enough to pretend he/she knows God's will.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quote:
So where does it go from here?

Lets hope it is not a murder suicide thing like Waco frown

When my father in-law chose to stop Kemo when he was told his cancer was terminal, should the government have stepped in?

He could have lived a couple more years with doing Kemo all the time and with a very slim margin of remission (the have to say it) was possible. In his own words "I will never do kemo again" he stopped. Should my mother in-law have contacted Anoka county and got the courts involved?

He started Kemo right after he found out he had cancer and given about the same percentages as they have given this boy if he goes back on Kemo. Right before he passed, he said he wished he never did it in the first place. It made the last year or so of his life the worst time he has ever experienced. He felt he could have done so much more with his family and friends if he never started Kemo.

In the end it was not the decision I would have made, but it is what he wanted. He was able to do this. I ask again should the government have stepped in and forced him to keep going for Kemo treatments? If you where in a situation like I described above, and in sound mind and body, would you want to have a choice, or someone else making the choices for you .

If you ever have experienced the rigors of Kemo you know how terrible of an experience it is . You look at the person under going Kemo and wonder how in the world is this helping them. All you can do is go by what the doctors say, but can you. When my father in-law went into his family doctor for some abdominal and lower back pains 3 years before he died, he was given a diagnoses at first to try carrying his wallet in the other back pocket, or stop carrying his wallet all together after his PSA test came back negative. This went on for a couple months and a couple more miss diagnoses was given. It wasn’t until he had major discomfort and went to another doctor for a second opinion. In the end what can you do? Maybe if the first doctor had ordered a CT scan at his first visit (now they give them out like candy) he could still be with us. In a round about "doctor" way, the second and third doctor told my father in-law if a proper diagnoses had been given when he went in at first, the treatment would have minor, and the chances of the cancer being gone would have been extremely high.

God forbid, but if I was ever in a situation where one of my children had cancer, I would being doing the Kemo treatment hands down. Government or no government, it would be done. That is my choice and should be no one else’s. The major problem I have with what the courts are doing in this case, is how they are stepping in on a parents rights to chose what they feel is best for their kid, while the parents are of sound mind, and body. If the kid suffers horribly during the treatment (from being threw it already I know this is a big reason the boy is rejecting going threw the treatment again), the boy falls in the 10% range and horribly the boy dies, what is that judge and the government going to say then? What "Oh well, we will fix it on the next try". It may be crazy thinking, but what if the treatment the parents are seeking did work? crazy The thing that bothers me is they are seeking treatment. It may not be what the government (or court) feels is best, but they are trying to help their son. They are not just letting him sit at home to dye, they are doing what they feel is best . Yes, let the government step in when someone has a belief that "God" told them to chop off their child’s arm or that "God" told them not feed their child. These sitiations have a direct out come of harm. Again God forbid if one of my children had cancer, Kemo failed, and they are found terminal, should I have the right to stop the Kemo treatment for my child, so my child can live the last couple months of their life with out undergoing the rigors of Kemo? Or should the court come in and force Kemo on my child so my child could get a couple more weeks/months in agony? Am I a bad neglecting parent if I chose to do this? Where does this end?

Here is what the AP has to say:

Quote:

May 15, 2009 - 4:30pm

By AMY FORLITI

Associated Press Writer

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) - A Minnesota judge ruled Friday that a 13-year-old cancer patient must be evaluated by a doctor to determine if the boy would benefit from restarting chemotherapy over his parents' objections.

In a 58-page ruling, Brown County District Judge John Rodenberg found that Daniel Hauser has been "medically neglected" by his parents, Colleen and Anthony Hauser, and was in need of child protection services.

While he allowed Daniel to stay with his parents, the judge gave the Hausers until Tuesday to get an updated chest X-ray for their son and select an oncologist.

If the evaluation shows the cancer had advanced to a point where chemotherapy and radiation would no longer help, the judge said, he would not order the boy to undergo treatment.

However, he said, if chemotherapy is ordered and the family still refuses, Daniel will be placed in temporary custody.

The judge wrote that Daniel has only a "rudimentary understanding at best of the risks and benefits of chemotherapy. ... he does not believe he is ill currently. The fact is that he is very ill currently."

It was unclear how the medicine would be administered if the boy fights it. Dr. Bruce Bostrom, a pediatric oncologist at Children's Hospitals and Clinics of Minnesota, said last week he would have a hard time forcing Daniel to take the medicine. Bostrom said Friday his hospital has psychologists, child life specialists and other resources to help ease Daniel's fears. He also said an ethics committee would meet next week to talk about all the scenarios doctors may encounter.

Daniel's court-appointed attorney, Philip Elbert, called the decision unfortunate.

"I feel it's a blow to families," he said. "It marginalizes the decisions that parents face every day in regard to their children's medical care. It really affirms the role that big government is better at making our decisions for us."

Elbert said he hadn't spoken to his client yet. The phone line at the Hauser home in Sleepy Eye in southwestern Minnesota had a busy signal Friday. The parents' attorney had no immediate comment but planned to issue a statement.

Daniel was diagnosed with Hodgkin's lymphoma and stopped chemotherapy in February after a single treatment. He and his parents opted instead for "alternative medicines" based on their religious beliefs.

Child protection workers accused Daniel's parents of medical neglect; but in court, his mother insisted the boy wouldn't submit to chemotherapy for religious reasons and she said she wouldn't comply if the court orders it.

Doctors have said Daniel's cancer had up to a 90 percent chance of being cured with chemotherapy and radiation. Without those treatments, doctors said his chances of survival are 5 percent.

Daniel's parents have been supporting what they say is their son's decision to treat the disease with nutritional supplements and other alternative treatments favored by the Nemenhah Band.

The Missouri-based religious group believes in natural healing methods advocated by some American Indians.

After the first chemotherapy treatment, the family said they wanted a second opinion, said Bostrom, a pediatric oncologist who recommended Daniel undergo chemotherapy and radiation.

They later informed him that Daniel would not undergo any more chemotherapy. Bostrom said Daniel's tumor shrunk after the first chemotherapy session, but X-rays show it has grown since he stopped the chemotherapy.

"My son is not in any medical danger at this point," Colleen Hauser testified at a court hearing last week. She also testified that Daniel is a medicine man and elder in the Nemenhah Band.

The family's attorney, Calvin Johnson, said Daniel made the decision himself to refuse chemotherapy, but Brown County said he did not have an understanding of what it meant to be a medicine man or an elder.

Court filings also indicated Daniel has a learning disability and can't read.

The Hausers have eight children. Colleen Hauser told the New Ulm Journal newspaper that the family's Catholicism and adherence to the Nemenhah Band are not in conflict, and that she has used natural remedies to treat illness.

Nemenhah was founded in the 1990s by Philip Cloudpiler Landis, who said Thursday he once served four months in prison in Idaho for fraud related to advocating natural remedies.

Landis said he founded the faith after facing his diagnosis of a cancer similar to Daniel Hauser. He said he treated it with diet choices, visits to a sweat lodge and other natural remedies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How many of the people here saying gov't shouldn't interfere also happen to be anti-abortion??? Just checking.

i am not sure what to think about this:

on one hand>

It's unfortunate and cruel, but I say let him take his flintstone vitamins and see how it works out for him. Maybe he can die in peace.

on the other>

The kid has been indoctrinated with his beliefs and is 13yo. he can't make decisions for himself. lock his parents up, knock him out, and give him the chemo. In ten years, he will probably still be bitter and think blah blah it was god's will.

i could coin toss this one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Me, and this is the funny thing. Here is part of what I wrote above.....

Also isn't this the same state where a 13 year old girl can get an abortion without parental notification, because she alone has the right of choice concerning her body? So a 13 year old alone can choose to end a life that is inside her, but another one who stands by his parents beliefs will get pinned down to a table and injected in order to save his???????

Does this make sense to you....kind if contradicting isn't it? It doesn't take a genius to see how messed up the world is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0